STP 138 How to Move Forward When You Don’t Have a Perfect Plan
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[00:00:05] Christi Engle: I had to change the metric of what I considered success, i'll leave this podcast and I'll think about what I said and what I wish I had said and what I wish I had said differently. play in my mind that part. instant and automatic, and that's okay.
[00:00:20] It's just part of my processing. once that happens, I then have a decision about how, what I'll do with that information and what I'll do from there. And in order to stop my head from ruminating and keeping me up at night and emailing you back and saying, oh my gosh, I wish I had said you. Like, Stop. I changed the metric. Okay. So I tell myself, I, goal wasn't to show up perfectly hit all the bullet points just right. That wasn't my goal. My goal was, was I prepared? Was I present in the moment and was I authentic? And those are three things that I were my metrics for how I show up in the coaching [00:01:00] space and how I showed up on the journey to get here.
Introduction: The Wisdom Trap
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[00:01:07] James Marland: You have the wisdom to change lives. The problem is you're close to maxing out. Giving all your time to others with burnout in your future.
[00:01:18] I'm here to help you design an income stream that truly leverages your wisdom. It starts when you stop chasing a full schedule and start scaling that wisdom into income without a ceiling. Now is the time to create more impact, more income, and more independence. I'm James Marland. Income Stream consultant and this is the Scaling Therapist podcast.
[00:01:53] Hello, and welcome back to the Scaling Therapy Practice. This is your host, James Marland. This is the show where [00:02:00] we help leaders make life-changing online courses and develop income flow. Today I am here with my special guest, Christie Engle She is a personal development coach and an Enneagram teacher, and she's gonna talk about how To make some changes in your life that lead to productivity and peace. So, uh, Christie, welcome to the show.
[00:02:26] Christi Engle: Thank you for having me, James. I'm happy to be here.
[00:02:28] James Marland: We met, or we met, we crossed paths on LinkedIn because we both went to the same college on Lancaster Bible College in, uh, Lancaster, Pennsylvania. And I love talking with coaches who are, who have done it, you know, they're a little bit farther along and they kind of explain. Make it possible for other people because if they can do it, you can do it.
[00:02:50] So I like to share messages of hope. And Christie was, was talking that she has a, uh, a story about how she became a [00:03:00] coach and just how she took one step after the other. And I thought it was an. A, uh, an energizing way to get into learning about how you can actually do this when you don't know the whole plan.
[00:03:13] Christie, welcome to the show and why don't you start telling us like, what led you to become a personal development coach?
[00:03:21] Christi Engle: Sure. I love to share this story because I think that many people can relate and I know that it was such an impactful part of my life, this particular journey. So coming out of college, I worked a little bit in the field. My degree was undergrad, was in counseling. And then I started our family and I stayed home with my boys and my focus was. On parenting them for the next foreseeable season. so any career decisions, aspirations, or job was put on hold, [00:04:00] while I was in that season with my children. For a time I worked at their school. So I got really valuable education, in in a school setting. Taught me so many things about myself, about the way that I work with other people. simultaneously I was learning the Enneagram, and I don't know if your audience is familiar, but the Enneagram is a personality typing system that helps you understand not just what you do. It's not just for the purpose of labeling us, it's for shining a light on our core motivations underneath our behaviors.
[00:04:33] So why we do what we do, and learning that system. And also having a core group of friends and family learning it along with me was really impactful because it gave us a new language, it gave us new understanding about ourselves. It helped me become a better partner, a better mother, and a better friend. So out of that, I became really passionate about [00:05:00] the work of the Enneagram. not just because again of the labeling part, that's not the part that's exciting at all. It's more that it gives you a path for growth. Once you name and identify some of your patterns, you can move beyond them. And so I became certified in the Enneagram and once I did that, I was really questioning in that season if I was gonna go back for a clinical mental health counseling degree. And to become licensed as a clinical mental health counselor. And I started coaching with that Enneagram certification. And two years later I started a coaching certification process. And the main idea about this story is that I never knew what the next step was. When I, whatever season I was in, I just, it was like my path was dark. I could name what I didn't want to do, but I couldn't name what I did wanna do. I couldn't name the end that I wanted to to. And so I consulted a lot of people that were, field [00:06:00] knew me and I asked a lot of questions and I just took the next step in front of me. It was like a flashlight shining on the next step, and I just took the next step and the next step. And it wasn't until fairly recently that I fully settled that licensure in a clinical mental health setting is not my ultimate pursuit. But coaching is, and I've already been coaching for three years officially. So out of that season, I started Perennial Coaching Services and I've been working with groups in a group setting for professional development or personal groups or clients, one-on-one in my home office or on Zoom.
[00:06:38] James Marland: Great. What a story, um, man, that that part about taking steps without really knowing what's in front of you really resonates. I think it's really difficult to do things that feel risky and a lot of times I talk with my friends who are coaches and, uh, we talk about. The brain wants to keep you safe.
[00:06:58] The brain wants you to [00:07:00] stop taking risks and doing something where you can't see the end result just feels really risky. So it might just be, you know, why don't you just go back and follow the normal path, you know, get your license and get that job. Or why don't you just, you know, instead of working for yourself, find a, you know, find somebody who'll give you a paycheck.
[00:07:19] And start, invest in that. Isn't that the right way to do things or isn't that the safe way to do things? How did you keep moving forward even when it didn't quite, your brain might be screaming, ah, don't do this. It's not safe. You know, you don't know what's gonna happen.
[00:07:35] Like how, like how did you work through that and, what were some of the things that helped you?
[00:07:40] Christi Engle: Yeah. And my brain was screaming that throughout the journey. I, a couple of things. One, I wrote down very clearly what it is that I see as my own personal strengths and how they align with the work that I hope to do. So I came up with a few [00:08:00] things. I know I like teaching. I know that's a, an area that is comfortable for me. I know I like the intersection of psychology and personal growth. and I've known for many years about myself that personal growth is something that I care deeply about. I care deeply about not staying stagnant or just developing on old rote patterns that are no longer serving me. So knowing that gave me a little bit of guardrails. And then I did what I mentioned earlier. I consulted some people that knew me well or knew the field well that I was considering going into. So I talked to a therapist friend of mine, and she affirmed me along the way. And slowly the process of my own growth allowed me to rely less on other people and their opinion and their affirmations. more on what I know to be true. And that's part of what I bring to a coaching setting now is helping other [00:09:00] people to be able to rely on the inner wisdom that lies within them. So it was just that it was taking what I know to be true about me and taking the next certification that was in front of me because that was in alignment with what I want to do. meeting with some clients and getting pro bono at first as you're building your practice and you're figuring out like my own style in the coaching room. And then slowly it's like you slowly emerge into a clearing now you have just a fuller sense of what it is that I am passionate about and that I am here to do.
[00:09:34] James Marland: Oh man that, that's a rich, a rich story. There's a lot of things in there. One of the things that resonated with me is the slow journey. The slow journey towards progress because, I like to make plans. Okay. I don't like to step out and not know what's going on, and so I like I'm a, I am a chronic learn.
[00:09:55] Learn just in case. Learn just in case like I learned to learn because [00:10:00] I might need it at some point. I'm like my dad who kept scraps, screws in a jar that you might use at some point because you never know when you're gonna need that old piece of wood or scrap to, to fix something.
[00:10:13] And I do that with learning. Like I learn and learn and learn. And so I get the, the planning phase is I really like the planning phase. But you can't get to where you're going by just planning. You just can't, you gotta fig that middle. There is a little messy, it's a lot messy, really as you go.
[00:10:31] And you touched on that with like, it slowly came out over time as you walked the path. What lessons do you think you would've missed out of if you didn't take some of those steps? Like, what are some of the things that you can't learn from planning.
[00:10:47] Christi Engle: I love that question. I really relate with how you're sharing your processes. 'cause I too am a. I like to know what's ahead of me and where I'm going. In this process I didn't have that [00:11:00] luxury. What I learned that I would've messed out, missed out on if I had a clear path that I just could rely on. I think one thing that comes to mind is I had to change the metric of what I considered success, and so that both. Applies to my journey to get to where I am today in coaching. And it applies to me showing up as a coach in this space. Like when I give a presentation and then I evaluate myself afterward. So you know how you'll speak a message from a stage or like today on this podcast, I'll leave this podcast and I'll think about what I said and what I wish I had said and what I wish I had said differently. play in my mind that part. instant and automatic, and that's okay.
[00:11:47] It's just part of my processing. once that happens, I then have a decision about how, what I'll do with that information and what I'll do from there. And in order to stop my head from ruminating and keeping me up at night and emailing you back and saying, oh my gosh, I wish I had [00:12:00] said you. Like, Stop. I changed the metric. Okay. So I tell myself, I, goal wasn't to show up perfectly hit all the bullet points just right. And never say when you're speaking. Like, That wasn't my goal. My goal was I prepared? Was I present in the moment and was I authentic? And those are three things that I were my metrics for how I show up in the coaching space and how I showed up on the journey to get here. And now that I have those as my metrics, when my mind starts to spin out, I say whoa. We weren't trying to be perfect. We were trying to be prepared, present, and authentic. Did we hit that? Was I prepared? Yes, I was prepared. I did my work ahead of time. Was I present? Yes, I was fully there. My attention, my my thought process, everything was right here. And was I authentic? Yeah, I was me. Flaws and all right, so that's a lesson that I take with me every single [00:13:00] event or coaching session, or podcast or any, anything that I do in my work.
[00:13:04] James Marland: Yeah, really good because if you, you there, it's so easy to focus on. What you don't have or what you didn't do, or you compare yourself to other people. That is so easy. One of my, one of my favorite stories. Oh, what was the book? Uh, it was a Benjamin Harding Coach, coach, strategic coach book. And he told about the story of giving a cookie to his kids, but they had to break it in half.
[00:13:29] And the one kid was like, ah, their cookie is bigger than mine, and got really mad about it. And, three seconds ago he didn't have a cookie. You know, three seconds ago there was no cookie. And so even getting something good made him mad because he was focusing on what he didn't have. And I'm like holy moly.
[00:13:48] That's what I do all the time, every day. I
[00:13:51] Christi Engle: Yeah.
[00:13:52] James Marland: have this and I get mad about it. And just if you could just be grateful for what's going on or as you said, I love, change your [00:14:00] metrics you can find the win. And that's what I tell my students. You gotta show up and you gotta find the win.
[00:14:06] And you read, I love how you read to find the win that, that's gotta bring such, that's gotta take some, a lot of the burden off right for you.
[00:14:16] Christi Engle: Yeah, it really does because otherwise. mind is overthinking, unproductive, thinking, spinning and it leaves me feeling defeated. It leaves me feeling and that's how I know that it's not a place I wanna stay because the fruit of it is bad. Like feel low down on myself. I feel like I'm not a good coach and I'm, here's why I shouldn't be doing these things and I shouldn't sign up for these. Larger events or I shouldn't. And and that changing the metric is one thing that I did to stop the process, and it's been effective.
[00:14:49] James Marland: Great. I think, uh, the other thing that you talked about, uh, that helped was you sign you addressed the stories you tell yourself. I forget how [00:15:00] exactly you said it. Stories from the past you addressed. And I know that's, that's one of the things they live in our heads and we repeat 'em over and over again and they served us at some point to keep us safe, but they don't, they don't serve us anymore.
[00:15:13] And I remember, when I came to realize, I used to think. Being in front of people, like getting on stage was dangerous, and unsafe, and you could fail and then people will laugh at you like a really elementary, junior high type. Thinking about putting yourself out there. When I realized that I was still operating with that story ringing in my head, it made, it made a huge difference in saying, okay, that was the past.
[00:15:43] That helped me when I was, when I moved to nine different schools growing up and you didn't wanna stand out 'cause people make fun of the new kid. Well, that's not, that's not how you run a business, you know, that's not how you do stuff. So knowing your stories is [00:16:00] huge to, to move forward. And it sounds like you, you had to, you had your own version of that as well.
[00:16:07] Christi Engle: Yeah I would say that in order to walk through that process that you just described, start to identify the thoughts that repeat in your mind, that kind of just fly around there. Rent-free and just I think of it as like a prop duster airplane, just making circles in your mind and dropping these bombs of
[00:16:24] Like dread or or imposter syndrome or whatever is the thing that you struggle with. step one is write it down. Get it out of your head, and let it land. Let it land on paper. Once it's on paper and it's out in front of you, it creates some distance from it. You're not so identified with it. And now that it's on paper, you can look at it and you can begin to examine it. can begin to ask, is it true? You can begin to ask, is it helpful or serving me? And this is from the work of Byron Katie. Who would I be if I let go of that message? Often for me the answer is, I'd be so much freer if I let go of the message that I don't belong here. Or if I [00:17:00] let go of the message that I need to hide in some way or be safe in some way. Then once I can identify that message is not serving me. Then I have the space to make a different decision and to move forward in a way that is more aligned and authentic in touch with who I am as a person, as a coach, as a leader.
[00:17:20] James Marland: That kind of leads us to some of what I wanted to talk about because like to getting into some of your strengths is being, um, authentic and not living on autopilot and living with attention intention. I love that because at some point in my life, I felt like life stopped giving me mission cards to accomplish.
[00:17:38] Like I graduated high school and I went to college. I got married, we adopted a kid. I got a good job. I went back to school like, okay, like, and then what? Then what do you do? You just work work until you die. Like, that's kind of autopilot. And I felt like I was like that for a while. So when you brought up that topic, I thought it was very interesting.
[00:17:58] I I don't know if [00:18:00] you wanna frame that topic or why it's important to you, or maybe just start out with how do you know you're living on autopilot? Uh, rather than living with intention. So what, what would you say about, about people who might struggle with just not living with intention?
[00:18:17] Christi Engle: Think when we are. Living in autopilot, we can identify that because beliefs that we're operating under are decades old.
[00:18:28] It may be something that was handed to us in childhood, and that doesn't mean that everything that was handed to us in childhood was not worth holding onto. I think our work is to decide and determine and discern what is worth holding onto and taking with us, and what is okay to leave behind and we can still honor. The leaving behind, we can still honor the people who gave it to us. But we can move forward in a way that is more authentic and true to us, and that is living with integrity when we do that. [00:19:00] I think it requires a process of identification of the beliefs that I am living under, like we talked about a few minutes ago. For me, the Enneagram shone a light. On the things that I was believing, like for example, one was that for in some ways I'm not capable. I have to outsource that to someone else and get their opinion before I can validate it for me. so that would be one. Another one might be that if I show up full in my fullness and I bring myself with. Any measure of confidence and in and authenticity, then I'm being prideful.
[00:19:38] Was sort of a message that I grew up with. It was never given to me explicitly, but it came along with the packaging and I began to identify, oh, I think I'm being prideful If I put my name out there, or if I say hey, I might have something to offer in this space. And so when I saw it, then I began to examine it and say, that's not true. I know my heart. [00:20:00] I know what's going
[00:20:01] Me and I'm not being prideful, so then I can move on from it. And finally the biggest thing I would offer is to examine the fruit of what you're saying in doing and how is it sitting with you?
[00:20:12] How is it working in your relationships? And if it's, if there's. Problematic issues or repeated patterns that are not serving you, it's time to identify those.
[00:20:21] James Marland: It sounds like this would be difficult on your own, like you're just blind by the forest. You know, you're blinded by the trees. You don't see the forest, you don't see you, you're not above it all. Like, I know it, it took me like getting coaching and doing some activities and examining why I was failing in some of the business aspects because I couldn't get outta my own way.
[00:20:48] And, and just like talking with a coach about that, like I, I know you can do it by reading books and stuff because that's that's. The first activity you said about writing it down and naming it and examining it if it's [00:21:00] true, I found that in a book and that sort of like started tearing away at some of the, the long held beliefs that I had had that didn't really serve me anymore.
[00:21:09] Where they were, they really weren't true or they were like 10th of a percent true. But it sounds, it sounds difficult to do by yourself. What. I, when I say that, what, what, uh, what comes to mind? Do you agree? Disagree.
[00:21:24] Christi Engle: Yeah I agree in this way. We are better in community.
[00:21:28] Are built for community. We are meant for community and people with whom we can be really honest and really laid bare, in a situation that is supportive and safe to do that because uh, not everyone has earned the right to hear your story. So you have to be discerning about who that person or those people are. along the way, I have picked up first of all, I'll say this. I'm a firm believer that teachers need teachers and coaches need coaches and therapists [00:22:00] need therapists, and pastors need pastors. I'm just a firm believer that we need each other. And so I along the way have picked up my own therapist my own spiritual director, my own group of friends in my community that I met with for seven years doing this work. we, it was like we. Took care of one another as we were each working out our own journeys. having said all that, it doesn't substitute the work that we need to do ourselves. And knowing my own shortcomings and calling myself on the carpet oh, there I go again. So both, and would
[00:22:40] James Marland: Yeah, no, great point. Yeah, community community is the group of people that help you start believing things that are true about yourself even before you believe them. Even before they're like in great. You know, that you believe them. They believe them. It changes a lot. Man, uh, time has [00:23:00] flown. I'm gonna ask one more question and then we'll get into, you know, where people can find you.
[00:23:04] So just, it sounds like there's a lot of internal work and also, you know, renewing your mind and like remembering things. So what are some of the, the daily habits or actions that you can take that support these new values and living intentionally instead of living on auto autopilot? What can we do?
[00:23:25] Just a few simple things.
[00:23:27] Christi Engle: I love that. 'cause I love a simple next step.
[00:23:31] James Marland: Yeah.
[00:23:32] Christi Engle: I leave my clients with in coaching is Okay. What's your next best step then, out of what we talked about today? So I would say number one, I didn't know for a long time the gift that we have in breath work in taking a breath in letting our breath. Bring down our, like reactivities, [00:24:00] helping our brain to calm down. So simple breath work. So it's like tuning in and just saying, okay, drop your shoulders.
[00:24:08] A lot of tension in your jaw. Soften. Soften. And it's I imagine having a backpack full of rocks just taking it off and setting it down. And if I can just stay there for a few moments, like this is something it's free to do. It's discreet. You could slip into a bathroom and do it for two minutes. Nobody would know the wiser what you're, if you just need a moment, and this could be an intense family situation at Thanksgiving, or it could be right before you're getting on stage.
[00:24:33] Or it could be just any moment that you need dial back the intensity that's going on in your own mind and heart and body. That's a lovely tool. Another one is, I call it I, it's something I work through with my clients. I call it the nourished method, but it's taking care of the basics or the essentials. So if we aren't taking care of the essentials, we don't have the foundation to do [00:25:00] deeper inner work. So if the last time we ate was yesterday at noon, okay, I'm gonna be cranky, right? Like, when's the last time you drank a bottle of water? When's the last time you got outside and away from the computer screen?
[00:25:12] So like basic things. For self care that matter a lot if you're going to engage deeper work or if you're gonna show up in your most healthy space professionally and personally. those are two that come off at the from the top of my head that are meaningful to me that I engage every day.
[00:25:34] James Marland: Great. And it, it's probably aligned with, um, I'm, I'm guessing at some point you, you set some sort of mission or vision. For yourself, like you said, you, you've discovered what you do best and you, you align yourself with that. And I'm imagining that there's some sort of foundation there that, that bolt bolsters the whole, the whole process.
[00:25:58] Christi Engle: Yeah, I [00:26:00] think for me taking all of the parts that make me who I am today. That includes childhood experiences and education and my own relational. Strengths and challenges that I've experienced and letting them inform what I bring to the coaching space today because I am my best I am bringing everything that I have to the party, and I'm saying this is what I have to offer as a coach.
[00:26:32] And it's different than what person over here has to offer as a coach. And that's okay because. When that is the case, then we are being truly authentic. If we were all cookie cutter coaches and offered the same thing, then nobody's being truly them. So my sort of, I, I wouldn't say like it's official, like I don't have it written on my website, but my mission in the world is to bring my experiences and uniquely who I am to the [00:27:00] space so that I can help other people to take their next best step in life. Whatever they identify that to be, whatever's in alignment with the goals that they have set for themselves and show up in a way that serves them.
[00:27:12] James Marland: That's wonderful. This has been a really great conversation. And just hearing about how another coach is sort of like. Found their way even when they didn't know where the next step was. It's, it is, it's pretty scary. But you're doing it and you're being successful and you're very grounded.
[00:27:32] So, if there's somebody out there who's like. Man there, there's no way I can do this. I don't even know how to do it. Well, that's how, you know what, that's where everybody starts mean. Nobody knows how to do it, uh, when they first start. So, uh, it's, uh, finding your way through the messy middle and, um, moving forward, there's a lot of things you learn by making mistakes.
[00:27:54] Yeah. I wanted to wrap up with like. If you have any last message and where people can find [00:28:00] you and what next step do you think people could take? But yeah, why don't you show us, like share us, like what's your webpage? What's your offer? And a next step. If somebody's like, oh, this is really connecting with me, what's the next step for them?
[00:28:11] I.
[00:28:11] Christi Engle: Super. I just wanna take 20 seconds to highlight what you just said, which is. Don't be afraid to make the mistakes. They are, they truly are our best teachers. And if we can allow them to be part of the journey and not reject them or try to avoid them at all costs, man it, that's rich soil.
[00:28:29] So stay there. It's good. It's good. yeah, I have a website that I people can learn about me, about my style and about what I have to offer. That's perennial coaching.com. You can find me on Instagram and LinkedIn and Facebook Perennial Coaching Services. Christie Engle on LinkedIn. I have a couple offers.
[00:28:53] They're all on my website. One that I'm really proud of is a $27 Boundaries blueprint [00:29:00] that helps you to identify and set boundaries so that you can move forward in a way that. Is more confident and less guilt ridden and helps to shore up your relationships rather than break them down. And other one I have is a perennial growth path, which is a five step coaching plan that I do.
[00:29:21] I meet with clients one-on-one, and we can do that in six or 12 sessions or I'm putting together a group option for that as well. So if anyone's interested the information's on my website.
[00:29:32] James Marland: Great. Wonderful. Well, this has been a good conversation. And all those, all those links will be in the show notes so you can look them up and look at the offers. Christie, thank you so much for being on the show.
[00:29:46] Christi Engle: Thanks James. I've had a great time with you today. Thank you for having me.
[00:29:50] James Marland: I hope my editor will remove that awkward pause as I was like. Struggling reading. Reading my next face [00:30:00] anyway, you know how that goes.
[00:30:02] Christi Engle: I do know how that goes. It's not easy. Yes.
[00:30:06] James Marland: all right, well thank you so much for being on the show. And listeners, it's now time to show up, make some mistakes, and put your mission in motion. We'll see you next time
